countersign on I/P

loankim · Post by **loankim** » Tue Apr 07, 2009 10:24 am

Dear all,

The document checker often meets a clause on I/P such as " This I/P is not valid unless it is countersigned " .
Would you pls tell me more about the reason of appearing that clause and who will coutersign ?
if I/P mentions that clause but lacking of the countersignature, i don't think that's a discrepancy, is it right ?
If Bene. is issured person , basing on ISBP 681/PARAGRAPH 38 in which the signature doesn't not necessarily mean that such box or space must be complete with a signature. Can i treat the signature on endorsement is also a countersignature so that Ben must not sign again. ( assuming that the party countersigning is Bene. )

rgds,

shahriar · Post by **shahriar** » Tue Apr 07, 2009 1:46 pm

there may be various reasons behind such clause. i know one of them. the insurance broker (who later also act as an agent) often has the preprinted policy where the insurance company prefers to keep this clause. not sure about other practice.

in my opinion, any document which says that it is not valid without a counter signature is not acceptable

wongvv · Post by **wongvv** » Tue Apr 07, 2009 1:51 pm

Hi !

According to ISBP no. 171, it states " if required by the insurance document......, all originals must appear to have been countersigned".

Hope it may help!

V.V.

shruti · Post by **shruti** » Tue Apr 07, 2009 2:14 pm

Dear loankim

why countersigned----shahriar comment may help1
when not so countersigned when credit explictly asked for the same---is it a discripancy ? yes
is endoseemnt can be treated as countersigned? we may , it depends on intentions.....

regards nkk

loankim · Post by **loankim** » Tue Apr 07, 2009 2:50 pm

Dear all,
Thanks so much for yr comments.

I have took one of reasons for appearing such clause. But i wonder whether you can tell me WHO will do coutersign. Some Insurance Certificates say that:" This Cert. is not valid unless countersigned by or on behalf of the exporter named above", whilst others only say:"This Cert. is not valid unless countersigned " . So that, it seems that the checker only need to pay attention
to the appearing of countersignature than party signing ( unless I/C shows in detail as mentioned )
How about your idea ?!

rgds,

iLC · Post by **iLC** » Tue Apr 07, 2009 8:18 pm

sorry.. but i actually never encountered a situation where an insurance policy is to be countersigned without mentioning who is to countersign. had i face such situation, my answer will depend on the other signature. if anyone of the signature fulfills the requirement of the UCP 600, then i would not bother about who is making the another sign. having said, i must add, that i would be very happy to refuse such a document because its an ambiguity in the document; not created by the issuing bank.

loankim · Post by **loankim** » Wed Apr 08, 2009 9:43 am

Hi ,
i have met a situation where an insurance policy is to be countersigned without mentioning who is to countersign and Bene countersigned onthat .
my scan error so i can not share it to you .
The issuer is WiLLis Ltd, an agent for Lloyd's.
Thanks for sharing your opinions and have a nice day !

rgds,

SHAMEER · Post by **SHAMEER** » Mon Apr 13, 2009 5:20 pm

According to ISBP no. 171 all originals must appear to have been countersigned".

Regards